So I was thinking about Hulk versus Thing fights, and wondering if Ben Grimm has ever been able to achieve victory without some extenuating circumstances.
It seems as though anytime the two fight, if the Hulk doesn't win, there's an outside factor involved. Either Grimm has some help (like the Fantastic Four), or his strength has been enhanced beyond its normal levels somehow, or the Hulk is weaker than normal. Like the time during the Simonson FF run when they fought, the Thing could become even more rock-monster like, and he fought Mr. Fixit Hulk at twilight, so the Hulk wasn't at full strength at time either, a double whammy. The Thing stomped him, only to get the favor returned later that night (in the pages of Incredible Hulk, natch).
See, I was thinking that even though Thing's strength normally doesn't match Hulk's, Grimm's usually the one more in control of himself, he's craftier, and he ought to be a better fighter. After all, the Hulk shouldn't know anything about fighting Banner didn't know (or that the Hulk hasn't somehow learned over the years), whereas Grimm grew up in an area with street gangs, so I'd imagine he's no stranger to brawling. I'm not saying he's a kung-fu master, but that the mental areas where he typically has an edge on Green Skin should be enough, combined with his strength, to net him a few clean wins here and there. Anybody know of any comics that fit that bill?
Of course, now he's gonna have to fight a Hulk who seems in control of his emotions, and has learned a few things about the art of combat, so those advantages just went flying out the window. Poor Ben, he's gonna get a whupping because of his big-brained stretchy idiot of a best friend. Isn't that the way it always goes?
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9 comments:
I'm very much afraid that in the new Hulk/Thing matchup, poor Ben will be reduced to tiny little pebbles. Pebbles that Hulk will shoot out into space using Reed's body as a slingshot.
If I was Ben Grimm and I heard that a super-intelligent warrior Hulk was coming after me, I would basically sit on Reed Richards until he invented some kind of armor or weaponry or SOMETHING. I don't see any way for him to go toe to toe with Hulk at all anymore without some kind of
The problem with Hulk vs. Thing is that beating up the Hulk is just about the worst possible way to attack him. With the whole madder stronger thing, hitting the Hulk just makes him that much more dangerous. Fighting skills don't matter. Ben either needs to get more creative or steal something from Reed.
sallyp: Yeah, that's what I'm worried about after that Frontline cover with the Hulk's "hit list", and a red X over Ben. What Spidey and Tigra were doing on that list I don't know. Hulk, they had nothing to do with this! Go smash Iron Man again!
nothing stops the blob: Reed probably does owe Ben some help, though with Ben I bet it's less about Hulk coming after him, and more about Ben trying to stop the Hulk's rampage. Still, some firepower would be nice.
joseph: True, but it feels like Ben could be clever enough to use that rising anger and strength against Hulk. Ben was a wrestler once, at least some of that is leverage and using your opponent's power against them.
I think Marvel's trying to get at "blowback" by putting Spidey, Tigra, Ben, etc... on the Hulk's list. Hulk is probably assuming that if Reed and Tony shot him into space, the FF and Avengers probably knew about it too, so collective punishment is in order.
Wasn't Ben in the military in the pre-Thing days? They do teach you some hand-to-hand combat techniques, so he's got more than just street-fighting as a background for that skill set.
Well in the Tales to Astonish issues right before the series ended The Hulk got into a massive fight with Namor.
Namor was pummled on land but, being Namor, he got his ass up and kept going. It's at this point Namor manages to get him into the ocean where Namor lays a beating on the hulk. To the point of punching the Hulk out of the water and into the beach where he passes out back into Banner. Hulk also had some guy trying to talk in his head at the end of the battle but the point is that Namor exploited a weakness in the Hulk to win.
So your idea about a fight with Ben Grimm under normal conditions holds water. Ben should be able to find a way to even things up.
if a fly hit the juggernaut in the temple it wouldnt do a thing...even tho the fly hit the right spot...ben can doge he can duck...he might even hit hulk square on the jaw..but the madder hulk gets the stronger..basickly he can go on forever..wheres ben would tire...hed be pounding away with all his might and get tired and still hulk would be standing..if black bolts yell wont stop him..no way ben can.
opppssss that was me above.....
gabesummers
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