I mentioned earlier in the week that I wanted to talk about the "Gang War" story in Amazing Spider-Man #284-288. A lot of what I think I want to discuss is how I think the work struggles and trips over itself, but I need more time to gather my thoughts on that.
OK, basic gist is that after Born Again, the Kingpin has vanished from the underworld playing field (for reasons beyond the fact he set a druggie super-soldier loose on American soil). So you have the Arranger (running things for Fisk), the Rose & Hobgoblin (who, 40+ issues after his 1st appearance still hadn't had his identity revealed), Hammerhead, Silvermane, and some assorted other groups fighting it out. Eventually the feds make an agreement with Fisk, allowing him to reenter the country and resume control of his empire, figuring it'll calm things down.
Throughout the story, Spider-Man is swinging around the city, stumbling across various skirmishes and doing his best to ensure no one dies. Besides bringing him into the gunsights of numerous criminals, he also fights with the Punisher, and is jerked around by Daredevil. See, DD thinks Spidey is just making things worse and wants him out of the way. He even goes so far as to phone Peter* and ask him to meet at a bridge, then leaves Spidey sitting there while the factions shoot each other at a bowling alley.
By the end of the story, Kingpin is back in charge, and he's even arranged things so that several of his lieutenants will be arrested and turn state's evidence, which will limit his capabilities for awhile. Daredevil convinces Spider-Man to help him again, telling Spidey Fisk actually plans to kill all these lieutenants. Spidey realizes he's been snookered again and charges to confront Kingpin. Of course, he can't actually do anything (besides smash Fisk's desk), which just causes him to leave in a furious state of mind. DD and Fisk chat a little afterwards, and Fisk describes Spider-Man as a naive child who will learn how the world works one of these days**.
So this is what strikes me as curious about this. When Spider-Man and Daredevil get together, Spider-Man is portrayed as the less mature one, more prone to hot-headedness and immaturity. OK, Spider-Man is younger, though I'd argue he's experienced enough tragedy to have already learned the harsh realities of the world. Still, the idea that Spider-Man is naive compared to Daredevil because he believes that making deals with evil men because you think it's the lesser evil doesn't seem quite on the ball. Daredevil, after all, is the guy who believes in the justice system (or he did in the early parts of the Nocenti run, which is where I'm most familiar with him). He's the one who beat up Spider-Man*** to stop him from killing the Sin-Eater because the man deserved his day in court. He's the guy who keeps trying (and trying, and trying) to bring down Fisk through the courts, only to frequently have nothing to show for it. But Murdock keeps doing it, so who's the naive one? Spider-Man understands the legal system is imperfect, that's why he wants to beat Fisk to a pulp, because the thing that is supposed to protect the innocent from the Kingpin does not.
I guess the naivete is supposed to come from Spider-Man getting angry with the flaws and trying to circumvent them, while Daredevil just keeps trying harder to fix them the flaws, or work through them. I guess that's the more adult way of going about things.
* This story is after the Sin-Eater story, where Peter and Murdock know each others identities by the end.
** Actually, one of the speeches Fisk makes to Spider-Man is very similar to the one he made in Amazing #542, right before Peter proceeded to beat the living crap out of Fisk. Boy, I enjoyed Spider-Man beating the crap out of Fisk.
*** I have entirely too many comics where Daredevil manages to beat Spider-Man, or at least fight him to a draw. Spidey can beat the Sinister Six, he can't beat some blind lawyer?!
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3 comments:
"believes that making deals with evil men because you think it's the lesser evil doesn't seem quite on the ball."
Ah but demonic entitities which are the literal incarnation of evil. That's ok.
I know it's repetitive to still be complaining about the end of one more day, but this is precisely the reason it still drives me nuts.
It's completely out of character for Peter. Peter's had plenty of times where it would have made "sense" to make a deal with the Goblin or Fisk or Silvermane or any of a dozen other characters. Peter wouldn't make a deal with them to make his life easier, or even to save the lives of people he loves (Gwen for example). Why make a deal with the devil? And trade MJ and any hope for his own future, for his elderly aunt.
GAH! Still irritates the heck out of me. Plus there's the lesson for the kids: Hey kids, make a deal with the devil and everyone'll be basically ok with it. Plus you'll get to meet the President!
I don't know about Spider-Man being naive, although I suppose that to the Kingpin, EVERYONE other than himself is naive. I do see him as being idealistic. More so than Daredevil, who as a lawyer sees the way that the justice system works in ways that Spidey never will.
I remember a story that told why the cops don't like Spider-Man, it's because he wraps up the criminals and then leaves, no evidence, no eye-witness accounts, no forensics, and a lot of the time, the cops have to let the bad guy go. If Spider-Man would just hang around once in a while and GIVE EVIDENCE, these crooks could be convicted.
seangreyson: Man, the relation to OMD completely slipped my mind. I guess that means he grew up like Fisk thought he would.
And historically, even on rare occasions he does make deals with bad guys (say, teaming up with Venom to fight Carnage), he hates himself for doing it, and tries to find some way to renege on the deal (using a concert sound system to incapacitate Venom and Carnage simultaneously). Which may not be completely honorable, but it does put both bad guys behind bars.
sallyp: I think I remember that story, or one like it. Paul Jenkins wrote it, back in the days before he had Sally Floyd berate Captain America for not watching NASCAR.
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